Talk:Portal:World History

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"Europeans"

isleños map

I don't know if this is even possible, but here's a place where people can start figuring out the history of the OGF world.

Since "European"-like languages seem to be most common, a good starting point might be to find out where these languages came from, where did they end up, and how did they get there.

  • Did the "Europeans" originate in one area, or in multiple areas?
  • In which areas did they replace "Non-Europeans?"
  • In which areas did they mix with "Non-Europeans" to form new cultures?
  • In which areas did the "Non-Europeans" prevent the "Europeans" from settling?
  • Are there parts of the world that do not fit into this narrative at all?

I've put together a quick map just from browsing around the OGF map, guessing at names, and looking at a few of the wiki articles. Most of the world of course is blank and full of question marks. If you can help correct any errors or fill in anything, let me know and I will change the map. Trying to figure this out may be impossible, but who knows, it might be fun.

--Isleño (talk) 05:42, 9 August 2014 (CEST)

I love this map!!! Great Job. For my country Pretany, it started out as small petty kingdoms. I have the entire history written down on the page. It is in the east section of the "Core European area" on your map. Pretanic is the official language which is very related to English, came from the west. If that helps at all. You can use whatever you need to out of my history, language, and culture sections on the Pretany page for use. Bhj867 (talk) 06:10, 9 August 2014 (CEST)
This can work, but I think the biggest problem are the rogue users. I have a feeling there may be people on here that will not want to cooperate with the larger community and want to form these "alien" countries that are completely independent to the rest of the countries culturally. Which doesn't work in the real world, and in a fictional world will look silly at best, and throw off the entire "History narrative" for the rest of us at worse. This is something that needs to be addressed now to every OGF member before those question marks become filled. Bhj867 (talk) 06:10, 9 August 2014 (CEST)
Map version 2: here Made some updates to the map based on feedback and info provided. I'm sure I forgot to add some things. Please feel free to let me know. Thanks! --Isleño (talk) 21:50, 15 August 2014 (CEST)
In context to my country, this is perfect! Bhj867 (talk)
looks good, your version # 2. Only one small detail: to Latina they get along the eastcoast of Tarephia and around the cap (only a small datail, not important for the whole 2nd version of your excellent map). And at the northwest of Tarephia you can set an "E" for Mofrede, english speaking. --Histor (talk) 22:05, 15 August 2014 (CEST)
Thanks, these changes will be in the next version. --Isleño (talk) 22:38, 15 August 2014 (CEST)
This map is very clear for explaining how cultures and languages spread across this world. The 'E' in Neberly is correct as i want 'my' country to be English. I haven't much given thought about the history of Neberly but i'd like it to be kinda old with cities and towns starting from the year 1000 onwards. This so i can create and explain medieval city centers. Therefor it's a pity that Neberly lies in the northeast, so far from the core European area. But maybe there was once an very ancient English culture that spread across the map but disappeared through a catastrophe? I'm kinda referring to the Atlantis legend. --Antoon (talk) 16:29, 5 September 2014 (CEST)

Ingerland

Thanks, the history of Pretany is great! So you think the English language came there from the west? I wonder if Ingerland could be the original source of English in this world. (Or "Inglish" perhaps?) As for 'rogue users' I think the admins have said that their first priority is a vibrant community where people can just have fun, so we have to be careful not to 'impose' any history on anyone or get too serious about it. In other words, there will probably be some weird rogue anomalies in the map and we just have to deal with it, haha. --Isleño (talk) 07:28, 9 August 2014 (CEST)
I don't think a few will be a problem. I think Ingerland may have been the original starting point for the English language. Like a prehistoric Saxony of sorts. BTW I invited all of the users to get in on this conversation. This is something I think we should all discuss in a way. We will see what happens. Also I think it is smart to start out the histories in a growth like pattern similar to earth, going from Tribal/Prehistoric->Fuedal/Medieval->Colonial/Emperical->National/Industrial->International/Modern through time. Of course each country will have their own histories and timelines and each country will reach these steps in various points through history, (The rise and fall of great empires so to speak). But when they are all hashed out individually I think it will be easier to come up with an overarching timeline and history with the obvious questions answered like "Where was the cradle of civilization?" "Who was the first empire?" "Who was the biggest?" "Who has the biggest population?" "Who has the biggest GDP?" Etc, etc and then we can edit the history page accordingly working with each user individually. Bhj867 (talk) 07:38, 9 August 2014 (CEST)
Thanks for spreading the word. I agree with all this. Just trying to figure out a good way to collate all this information from individuals and make sense of it... --Isleño (talk) 02:51, 10 August 2014 (CEST)
I have a split personality. One of them is the "worldbuilder", who want's to create a fictional world that's as perfect as possible, where everything is super-coherent and tightly interwoven. So, the more plausible our world history gets, the better. The other one is the "site admin" who wants the project to thrive, which it probably wouldn't if I tried to prescribe the members some coherent scheme. I think the spirit of "here's a mapping tool for you, select an area and do with it (mostly) what you want" is crucial for OGF to work as a project. It wouldn't probably have taken off if had been "we're going to build a fictional world, lets start with a discussion about ancient history and work our way upwards". OK, now I'm having an idea: let's have this discussion in all thoroughness, and then we'll throw the current world map away and start over with a perfectly coherent world (haha, just kidding, but now I know what I'll post next April 1st). In the end, just for practical reasons, the "site admin" will always take precedence, because if the site doesn't thrive, all other discussions are moot. --Thilo (talk) 22:19, 9 August 2014 (CEST)
I completely understand. My hope is that the people who want a coherent history can ignore those who don't; and the people who don't want a coherent history can ignore those who do. --Isleño (talk) 02:51, 10 August 2014 (CEST)

Indeed. A very helpful map. Gratulations.

As I wrote it yesterday - Western Uletha seems as a mirror-picture from Europe and the eastern part of this continent a mirror of Asia. So the association, that the "Europeans" came from Western Uletha is the suggested idea. And so I till now set the temporal structure in my wikis for Latina or Zylanda = Stone Age, Bronze Age, Olderdom, Christianity, discovering the world roundabout 1500 AD., railways ca. 1840 and now is 2014. Only the World war I and II must not be real in this world. If someone will write a history of this planet - in this structure I found my countries. --Histor (talk) 10:56, 9 August 2014 (CEST)

Wiwaxia

I agree with everyone, very helpful map! So far I've been very hazy on my history of Wiwaxia. I'm going to go through and read your various histories before adding more/changing what I've written (kudos to all of you for truly amazingly well-thought out histories, btw). And I'm definitely realizing that if we're going to mirror the real world, my little British-y country (which seems to be about where Malaysia is) must have been colonized at some point by Ingerland! It's going to be fascinating to see how this evolves --Demuth (talk) 12:22, 9 August 2014 (CEST)

Hi there, I'm surprised Wiwaxia is so old! I mean, I saw the castles and stuff but figured they were early colonial outposts... I guess all those straight county boundaries made me think it was a lot newer. In any case have fun figuring out the history! --Isleño (talk) 02:51, 10 August 2014 (CEST)
I do have a tendency to draw too many straight lines, whether its counties or city streets. But I would say the straight county boundaries are definitely modern(ish) even if the original counties are old; the boundaries have just been redrawn to make things work better administratively. But, the age of Wiwaxia, not to mention its origins, are very problematic. I suspect I'll need to make adjustments as this evolves. --Demuth (talk) 21:54, 10 August 2014 (CEST)
And now I've totally rewritten Wiwaxian history [[1]]! All things considered, it just makes so much more sense to have Wiwaxia as a "later" colony rather than a natural migration. --Demuth (talk) 17:29, 11 August 2014 (CEST)
Personally I think you've made the history even more interesting than it was before. Kudos! --Isleño (talk) 06:57, 12 August 2014 (CEST)

Karolia

In response to a message posted on my talk page regarding language, a few points about Karolia, and about the spread of languages and cultures in general:

  • - Karolia is bilingual, with the most widely spoken language based on the real-world Finno-Ugric languages (Finnish, Hungarian and Estonian) and the minority language being based on Romanian, Friulan and other Romance languages. Although the F-U language group is found within real-world Europe today, it is not actually Indo-European in origin, and Hungarian is distantly related to Mongolian, Estonian/Finnish to the Sami languages. So it is therefore not inconceivable that this language group in the OGF world originated away from the area in Uletha where we are suggesting the main European languages originated from. As the overall culture and economy of the country is very much like Eastern Europe (yes, I know geographically it's actually near the equator) this would also fit.
  • - I have already created a micro-state and plan to make the north of my territory into another independent country, so these would share similar cultural and linguistic characters to Karolia.
  • - There is no reason why there could not be more than one continental power centre in the world. In the ancient and medieval times, empires in China, India, West Africa and the Arab world were as powerful as Rome or the Holy Roman Empire, and so it could be formulated that other mercantile power bases were established and survived to this day through industrialization. Coastal areas seem particularly good for this as they allow the possibility of overseas trade from an early period.
  • - That said, the world would need to have less developed countries that were the subject of colonization in the nineteenth centuries, and were still used for manufacturing and agriculture today, for a global economic model to work.
  • - We also haven't mentioned what sort of natural resources the OGF world has compared to our own and whether it is experiencing similar climate change effects (or did everybody start using renewable power in 1950 and this hasn't happened).--Sarepava (talk) 20:04, 9 August 2014 (CEST)
Good points. There could definitely be other major powers out there, besides the "Europeans." Maybe the Sathrians are one, or the Commonians. Thanks for letting me know about Karolia. Btw there is a Hungarian country underway in the "European" area so you may want to coordinate on that, if you want a coherent history.
Let me say it so: Many peoples in the beginning have drawn their "dreamland" without connection to other lands. And with no embedding in a special time or history.
That anybody has neighbors, came later. So til now Latina and Zylanda lay "isolated" (and therefore I draw long shipping lines). In other parts of the OGF-planet you have the lucky situation, to can discuss details and connections with your neighbors. So now is to seen the other side: a given structure for all countries in historic evolution. I think, there the given items must not goe too in the detail. --Histor (talk) 22:07, 9 August 2014 (CEST)

Akinyaka

The map of the history and the languages looks great so far. I would like to add some things about Akinyaka, though:

  • Akinyaka has some regions that speak French (as of 8/14, I haven't mapped them extensively yet), so I would like that corrected on the map. Where would the French language originate from in the OGF world? (Side note: the "French" provinces and their people are leading a secession movement, which could lead to me forming a new country out of Akinyaka.)
  • The terrain of Akinyaka is really interesting, and it's hard for me to think of a geological history for a lot of areas. For example: here, where the roads go "wobbly" and then straight, there is a huge ascent (~1100 meters) to a very flat area, and then mountains. How would this be explained? I was thinking this could have been the shore of an old lake (like the Niagara Escarpment in Canada), but then I realized that couldn't be true because that was a bay opening up into a part of an ocean with no narrow parts. Maybe we should start a talk page about the geological history of the OGF world?

That's all for right now. tom_m7 (talk) 06:34, 15 August 2014 (CEST)

Good idea about a geology page. I'll start one. Re: French, I don't know. There's no French country in the core European area. Maybe French in this world evolved as a trading language or something? --Isleño (talk) 22:31, 15 August 2014 (CEST)

Sathria

The history of Sathria reaches very far back, maybe something like 2000 BC. However it is the "Sathrian" Empire only since around 300 AD. Its predecessor was the Ionean empire, centered around the city of Ionea in what is today southern Sathria. Maybe you can think of southern Sathria as Mesopotamia or Egypt, and the Sathrian central highlands as Persia. The role of northern Sathria with the formerly independent kingdom of Pactouria, I have not yet determined. Other sources of inspiration for Sathrian history will probably be Byzantium and imperial China. The neighboring UL202 (doesn't have a name yet) will be inspired more by Greece (I mean, just look at it), and much of its history has to be determined by the constant struggle against its mighty neighbor to the east. Little is known about Roantra before 500 BC, but at that time the first cities in southern Roantra arose, probably heavily influenced by UL202ian culture. At the same time, invaders from somewhere northeast invaded the Roantian northern island and founded what was later to become the Kingdom of Roantra, its first capital being the city of Arnamun. The southern part of Roantra was then gradually conquered during the years 1100-1400. The languages of Sathria (which has several of them), Roantra and UL202 are to a certain degree related, and the language group is intended to be not Indo-European. In Sathria, there will also be a few German-speaking areas, where people from Kalm migrated in the middle ages (like e.g. Transylvania). --Thilo (talk) 22:59, 9 August 2014 (CEST)

That is crazy. That is perfect how it fits right into my world history. The first known explorer into the region of petty kingdoms of Pretany came from the southern coast of Sathria around 250 BC named "Ava". He wrote the Athanza Cartis. An early Ptolemy, roman-like description of the people that lived beyond the Egyt Mountains that border our countries. The word "Pretany" or "Prenti" is a Kalmish word of unknown origins, coming from a missionary group from Kalm into the Pretanic region in 300 AD. That is almost mind-reading awesome.Bhj867 (talk) 00:24, 10 August 2014 (CEST)
Thanks Thilo, this is getting interesting because it challenges the boundaries of what is "European." Obviously none of these languages are borrowed from real-world Europe, but if the primary influence for the culture is Greek then I'd probably color it "European" on the map. But if Sathria is more Near Eastern in flavor then I might color it "Non-European." I like the fact that they're not so easy to categorize. --Isleño (talk) 02:51, 10 August 2014 (CEST)
Actually I don't mean to challenge anything. I think we should cleanly differentiate between "in-world" and "out-of-world" information; "in-world" is the information on the content pages, while we have "out-of-world" discussions on about how structure and interconnect the in-world information on the talk pages. Hopefully I'm correct if I view your map as an out-of-world map to help us organize our world history. Then there's the question of what it actually tries to achieve. For me, the most glaring incongruity of the OGF world is the weird language distribution. In this regard, Roantra/Sathria/UL202 avoid this problem entirely and can safely be classified as non-European (out-of-world), while in-world the label "European" makes no sense at all. Nevertheless, if you'd make a visit to Sathria, it would probably feel very European. But IMO that doesn't collide at all with having some completed unrelated language. The real problem lies where in-world and out-of-world information overlaps. For example, nothing could stop us (in-world) from e.g. having Dutch as the language of some aboriginal tribe on an remote archipelago, but nothing can change the fact that even in-world dutch is still closely related to German, simply because it's obvious. Dutch is also (more distantly) related to Russian or Hindi, which IMO is non-obvious enough (at least with regard to place names) to be conveniently ignored. Another example is the distinction between "old countries", which have a long cultural history in their present location, and "colonial countries", where most map-relevant features have been created by migrants from somewhere else during the last 300 years. It's relevant because it creates visibly different patterns on the map. Also, it's somewhat implausible to have "old" and "colonial" countries intermingled in the same continent. Explanations for that are hard to come up with, but these are the problems that we have to solve (says my worldbuilder personality). --Thilo (talk) 20:45, 10 August 2014 (CEST)
That's right, the map is an out-of-world attempt to gather information about the locations of cultures and languages so that we can try to formulate a history that might explain their distribution. To be clear, the map is actually showing two different things: (1) the languages that exist in various areas, and (2) the location of cultures with a broadly "European" feel. I put these two things on the same map because I suspect they are very strongly correlated; in other words, most people using "European" names are probably imagining a culture with "European" flavor (or one with colonial influence from a "European" flavored culture), and most people using "Non-European" names are probably imagining a culture that does not feel like Europe. (So far, Roantra/Sathria/UL202 may be the only exception I'm aware of, i.e. an area that would feel "European" but not using a European-based language. So if the feel of Roantra/Sathria/UL202 is generally "European" then I would make it orange on the map, because it is culturally related to the other orange areas, forming part of the "European" cultural core.)
As for explaining the worldwide distribution of cultures and languages, I'm starting to think that the easiest way may be to define two distinct types of migration: First, ancient migrations, over 1,000 years ago, where for example a group from Ingerland may have traveled over many years to the location of Wiwaxia, displacing whatever original people may have lived there and fully settling the country as their own (these countries would be colored yellow on the map). And second, the colonial patterns of the past few hundred years, where for example colonists from Ingerland may have sailed to Gobrassanya, and today their descendants coexist with indigenous people (these countries would be colored green on the map). We would have to explain why the language of the ancient migrants did not diverge more from that of the mother country despite so many centuries of separation, but perhaps we can come up with something? --Isleño (talk) 23:16, 10 August 2014 (CEST)


Bayland

Just to mention, I don't think "Dutch (or related)" best describes Bayese (the language of Bayland). The language is a hypothetical descendant of Old Saxon. This makes it a West Germanic (ingvaeonic) language, related closely to Low German. It is then also related slightly more distantly, but more close than Dutch, to the Frisian languages. It is also technically more closely related to English than Dutch, but due to English's large amount of non-Germanic vocabulary, I wouldn't class Bayese as English or related over anything else Germanic. So, basically, I think it would probably fit better into "German (or related)". Apart from that, I really do like how the map is coming along so far. I think the whole history of the world is a really interesting topic for discussion. --Fleur (talk) 04:37, 10 August 2014 (CEST)

Thanks, this is exactly the sort of correction I'm looking for. In fact I initially made the same mistake with Zylanda too. As an American, these "Low German" related languages just look Dutch to me. --Isleño (talk) 19:34, 10 August 2014 (CEST)
As an American, I concur. Bhj867 (talk)
Dutch is low-German. Only because the Netherlands are an indepencent country since 1648, the Dutch language is seen as an own language. But most of the linguists say, it is "rheinfränkisch" (francian from (lower) Rhine). So a speaker of low-German dialects (like lower-Saxon) in Northern Germany can read Dutch with few problems. --Histor (talk) 22:18, 10 August 2014 (CEST)
Eitherway, I'm now changing Bayese so it will be a part of a new hypothetical sub-family of Proto-Germanic. This will make it related to all Germanic languages more or less equally so I'm not sure how we'd categorise that. Possibly just as Other (Germanic) ? --Fleur (talk) 21:09, 11 August 2014 (CEST)
Interesting, looking forward to see how it turns out. As for the map categorization, yeah, I think "Other (Germanic)" would do. --Isleño (talk) 07:01, 12 August 2014 (CEST)
Indeed. I may also add a minority language to Bayland, probably concentrated more towards the south of the country. It'll probably be Finnic or Celtic but I haven't decided what yet. --Fleur (talk) 12:52, 13 August 2014 (CEST)

Rogolnika

Hello people. Okay, so maybe in the map, you can label Rogolnika as a "Non-Europeans predominate" since some names I think, don't sound European at all. HOWEVER, other names sounds European (I realized I just contradicted my statement), especially some cities and towns. Ergolanyum sound very European. (Actually some names are just made-up). However some street names in my cities are a combination of English and invented/made-up Rogolnikan names. I don't know. I'm just having a hard time thinking about this right now.

My supposed to be 'logical explanation' for my country, I think, is that an "English country and a major global maritime nation" reached Archanta and colonized my country "Rogolnika", hence the English language was introduced, then somehow the tribes united together using the English language since the tribes realized that it is the English language that can unify them against their English colonizers. Then, they rebelled and have successfully driven the "Ingerish" colonizers out of the land. On the other hand, the tribes retained the English language as their 'unifying language', however, the Rogolnikan names for places were returned.

Does this explanation sound "logical" enough? Maybe, or maybe not.

My proposed history for Rogolnika would be: (...this is only an unofficial draft...) -After the liberation of the Rogolnikan tribes from the Ingerish, they will form a kingdom and alliances from their western neighbors. It will become a kingdom and a colonizer, as the Kairranui Islands being their largest possession in the Central Ocean. -Monarchy will be the government until the 18th/ or 19th century, when the monarchy was deposed, and a republic was established. However, the monarchists will retaliate against the revolutionaries, and a civil war will take place. -The republic will only exist a decade and a few years and after that, a dictatorship will rise to power, then that dictatorship will slowly return to a democratic rule. --Boge (talk) 21:43, 09 August 2014 (MST)

Hey thanks, this makes sense to me. It's definitely possible to have a "Non-European" country where the unifying language is a "European" one. I think the "English country and a major global maritime nation" will have a big role to play in Khaiwoon, in Onnutu, in Gobrassanya and elsewhere. Perhaps it could be Ingerland, or...? We'll see where this goes. --Isleño (talk) 19:34, 10 August 2014 (CEST)

Mazan

Just to let you know, Mazan is Non-European. My country is Semetic (North African-Middle Eastern). Wal (talk) 21:11, 22 September 2014 (CEST)

Roliqia

Roliqia is not European at all, despite it being surrounded by predominantly "European" countries. I based their languages off of Finnish, Mongolian, and many Native American languages.

Years

In several wiki-articles here are written years. So I think, it is useful to collect this for an overlook, if anybody at anytime will write the "history". Please - set your items chronological and with a link -Histor (talk) 23:49, 9 August 2014 (CEST)

BC

  • 1000 = "Graves of the god" - social struggles between native tribes in SE Tarephia. Latina
  • 790 = Gahokalapa, "king" of an indigene tribe in the Latinian plain, founded the fortress of Pokelohuppon Hitatafaka
  • 250 = Athanza Cartis, written by Ava from Sathria, describes a war-like region that is a hostile and cold past the Egyt Mountains. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 200 = an amalgamation of coastal tribes developed into a significant maritime power and were able to establish trade routes across the Archanta Sea. Karolia

AD

  • 300 = Great works of Palast is written by missionaries from Kalm venturing into the 6-petty kingdoms region. Word "Pretni" is used to describe the region. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 360 = "Pretni" was known only to the western half of the uletha as an inhospitable mysterious hazy maze of waring tribes beyond the mountains. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 600 = The Great Reformation starts with trading allowed beyond Sathria through the mountains into Pretany by the Rusky Tribe. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 604 = First "brotherhood" of transport-workers over the isthmus Mecyna
  • 840 = Siege of Rusky by the Inarans. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 900 = Inarans form the Inaran Nation. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 850 = First recorded history of Edicarian people in the Little Saga of Salaka. Wiwaxia
  • 1039 = King of Inara wrote the first national constitution which granted access to the Nortian city of Port Emporia on the Great Rift Sound. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 1135 = The Stone of Bayland was created near modern-day Kronburg with an inscription declaring that King Ulfan has power over what is now the north of Bayland. Bayland
  • 1200 = Pretanic monarch converts to Catholicism. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 1357 = Egyt war of 1357 when Duke Beglidere from Norad, Garlis, invades Pretany and overthrows king. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 1372 = The Federal Monarchy of Pretany comes into power. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 1378 = Constitution of Freedom was drafted in 1378. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 1402 = Petty Kingdom of Inara is formed.
  • 1423 = Annexation of surround lands. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 1477 = Van Pelt landing, New Holland colony Latina
  • 1488 = The Bergez Brothers discovered the northcoast of Anteraphia Bergez Brothers
  • 1488 = The Bergez Brothers founded Latina Latina Bergez Brothers
  • 1522 = First missionares settlement in Cascande
  • 1534 = Du Bois settlement Latina
  • 1537 = Colony Zylanda founded Zylanda
  • 1560 = Ingerish Colony of Rogolnika established Rogolnika
  • 1608 = Jørpenilands to Zylanda Jørpenilands
  • 1637 = Ingerland buys rights to Edicaria (Wiwaxia) from Kalm and begins colonization Wiwaxia
  • 1655 = Zylanda become Kingdom and french speaking (french troups) Zylanda
  • 1722 = Wiwaxia declares independence from Ingerland Wiwaxia
  • 1727 = Official proclamation of the Kingdom of Rogolnika Rogolnika
  • 1772 = Wiwax-Padjadjaran War Wiwaxia
  • 1777 = New Holland Colony independent (from Dagelanden) Latina
  • 1789 = Karolia unified from alliance of city-states Karolia
  • 1824 = Latina united and independent Latina
  • 1844 = First Railway Latina - Saguset Latina
  • 1845 = Rogolnika became a constitutional monarchy; it lasted until 1868 Rogolnika
  • 1857 = Constitution ratified, Wiwaxia becomes constitutional monarchy Wiwaxia
  • 1864 = Zylanda independent from the French-speaking kings Zylanda
  • 1886 = Rogolnikan Republic proclaimed; civil war followed Rogolnika
  • 1890 = Civil war in Rogolnika ended; republic restored Rogolnika
  • 1912 = Canal of Mecyna with 60 m opened Mecyna
  • 1940 = Rusky breaks away from Pretany. Kingdom of Pretany
  • 1984 = Canal of Mecyna upgraded to 120 m Mecyna

Research Conclusions on the Settlement of the Brythonnic Imperium

The Brythonnic Imperium has researched and analysed a complex history of its place in the universe, concluding that to humanity 'Opengeo' is an alien planet, only colonised by humans approximately 4500 orbits (called 'yarus' = local years of 18,032,914 seconds) around [the M-Class star named] 'Umbrant' ago. Umbrant itself is in thrall to the G-class star 'Birluthea', eccentrically orbiting the latter once every 7204 or so yarus; this figure in constant flux due to Umbrant's orbit still not having completely settled around Birluthea following capture some 4.5 billion yarus ago. Umbrant is the smaller, a relatively 'cool' red star, while Birluthea is larger, hotter and yellow.

Opengeo sustained three separate 'genesis-events' in the extremely deep past, each giving rise to its own 'tree of life' ~ The three trees all originated far earlier than the limits of human paleontology can accurately discern, but to the best of scant human knowledge they each developed in physical isolation, becoming established before ever meeting at all, and by the time the earliest fossils so far discovered indicate, all three existed in a certain balance geologically soon following. The 'Archaean Tree' led no further than producing the planet's fungal-analogue saprophytic branches of life, culminating in the rare but long-lived semi-sentient giant species whose decentralised network nervous ganglia are telepathically compatible with humans. The next further advanced 'Decapodal Tree' gave rise; as its name implies; to the radiation of both animal-like and plant-like speciation that produces the ten-limbed genera of Opengeoic lifeforms ~ classified as being far more primitive (and dinosaurian in appearance) than members of the third major tree of life. The most advanced 'Hexapodal Tree' of again both animal-like and plant-like speciation, gave rise to much more mammalian-analogue & avian-analogue six-limbed life-forms.

It should be emphasised here that both decapodal & hexapodal genera include plant-like forms, yet there is no clear break between the animal-like and the plant-like in either radiation; rather both exhibit a continuum of forms between the one extreme and the other. One of the major differences between decapoda & hexapoda is the tendency for the former to produce mid-radiation forms with animal-like larvae and plant-like imagines, while for the latter the opposite tendency is true. This fact forms a useful rule-of-thumb in the categorization of 'difficult species' e.g. worm-like and snake-like species having eschewed all limbs; certain marine and riverine species with 'odd numbers of extra or non-atrophied limbs -&- both radiations arthropod-analogue genera with extra limb-segments. Saprophytes from the archaean tree can also occasionally be cosmetically confused with decapodal/hexapodal species, particularly larval stages of the non-sessile carnivorous subspecies ~ however the simplest of microscopic assays readily reveals the completely variant structure evident in genera of the archaean radiation.

It has also been discovered that decapodal life-forms prosper more than the hexapods during periods when Umbrant is in the ascendent, yet hexapods have historically out-competed the decapods during the times that Birluthea dominated. This stellar-cycling has never directly appeared to affect the archaean genera overmuch, however it is speculated that the indirect factor of decapodal saprovory should have evidenced in the fossil record; that it hasn't indicating a possible boost to archaean genera under Umbrant's influence. Of course, it may simply be a mirage that will disappear as more fossil evidence is gathered.

Neither the decapodal nor hexapodal radiations retain any single-celled representatives and both appear to have evolved to exclusively contain multi-celled varieties at roughly the same period in prehistory ~ approximately 2 billion yarus ago. This left the field open as it were, for the archaean tree to fill the void, and it is strongly suspected that in doing so the archaeans sacrificed their own opportunity to also evolve into mainly multi-celled forms. Nevertheless, in avoiding this move, and only giving rise to a limited number of (saprophyte) multi-cellular organisms a further half-billion yarus later, the archaeans may have advantaged themselves ~ it being estimated that in terms of simple biomass, the archaean tree outweighs that of both the decapodal & hexapodal trees combined, several-times-over!

When humans first arrived on Opengeo, they brought with them many varieties of Earth flora & fauna, expecting to simply replace local species with their own wherever they settled. This endeavor failed miserably as no introduced species ever thrived and most actually died quite rapidly. Many Earth species were however preserved in a few special hermetically-sealed artificial environments, awaiting the necessary scientific breakthroughs which might allow them to survive and thrive in the native environment.

@ ‎Saint Piran = Yeah. First I think, it is ever good to sign his text with -- and four ~ as usual in Wikipedia. And second: Why do you not write this over 5000 Bytes in an article over your land? --Histor (talk) 21:11, 10 August 2014 (CEST)


Apologies @Histor... I don't understand what you are referring to.

@Saint Piran = He is referring to the fact that you should write this narrative to your land, Brythonn, here in the Wiki, so that at least your land has a description on it. His first language is not English. (Boge)

@Boge = I'm not aware of the page being referred to? Where is it?

@ Saint Piran: In Wikipedia (and here) it is usual, to signature the written text. You make it so, that you write -- and thereafter, without space, 4 times the ~.

Under the continent "Antarephia" you had the name of your land in red. Click on it and you see an empty page. There you can write over your land. So you can copy this, what here is written and paste it in the empty page. Good luck --Histor (talk) 21:58, 10 August 2014 (CEST)

Languages

Hey everybody. I know there have been different discussions of languages in different places, but I thought this might be a good spot to gather them. And perhaps we need to start a "languages" list? Anyway, I noticed an inconsistency with Ingerland and its language (since many of us seem to have co-opted Ingerland, without contributions from its poor owner, as an ur-country to explain our own widely spread English-y speaking countries in OGF). I've been using "Ingerish" for the language, and I see others used "Inenglish" or "Inglish". I chose Ingerish because it's a bit further from English, and it's a little closer to Ingerland. Any thoughts on this? --Demuth (talk) 22:42, 3 September 2014 (CEST)

This is a good idea, so I'm making a test list below. If it catches on then we might make it in-world wikipedia style and move it to its own page, but to start with I'll just put it here, and anyone who wants to add can do so. I'm thinking one line for each significant language in each country. If the language is extremely minor then it probably doesn't need to go here.
--Isleño (talk) 03:12, 18 August 2014 (CEST)


Country Language
(in-world name)
Language
(real world description)
Usage in this country Did this language originate in this country? If not, how and when did it get there? Obvious relation to other in-world languages?
OnnutuFlag.png Onnutu Ingerish identical to English Widely used and understood by 90%+ of Onnutu's population No Brought by colonists from Ingerland? 1600s-1900s? Obviously related to other in-world European languages, presumably originating in NW Uletha.
OnnutuFlag.png Onnutu Onnutuan vaguely Pacific-inspired but not related to any Earth langauge Widely used and understood by 90%+ of Onnutu's population Yes Not obviously related to other in-world languages, but might be fun to link it to the Lono language of Lonowai Islands?
Khaiwoon flag.png Khaiwoon Ingerish identical to English Used and understood by 95%+ of Khaiwoon's population No Brought by colonists from Ingerland? 1800s-1900s? Obviously related to other in-world European languages, presumably originating in NW Uletha.
Khaiwoon flag.png Khaiwoon Khaiwoonese vaguely Asian-inspired but not related to any Earth langauge Widely used and understood by 75%+ of Khaiwoon's population Yes Hopefully related to some of the native Gobrasi languages in Gobrassanya, particularly those in the southeast?
Flsg.jpg Pretany Standard Pretanic Standard Pretanic is a Kalmish-English language and is closely related to and classified alongside English. To a lesser extent, it is also related to the early proto-Kalmish languages from early immigrants. Official Language but only spoken exclusively by 5.7% of the population due to the rise in English popularity. 30% speak it as a second language. Yes Was the vernacular of the Pretanic people for over a thousand years and was probably introduced by some sort of early Ulethian migration during the 4th century AD, possibly earlier. The Great works of Palast, was written in the 300 AD by a peacekeeping missionary brigade from the region that is now Kalm. Many missionaries stayed and influenced the region greatly. Mixture of proto-English and proto-Kalmish, introduced by missionaries, There must have been some form of missionaries from Ingerland that also immigrated there early in the history.
Flsg.jpg Pretany Modern English/Inglish/Ingerish Indentical to English English is the official and predominant spoken language in Pretany, spoken by 90.5% of the inhabitants. No Has been spoken only for 150 years. English grew in popularity due to globalization of corporations in the 19th century. It became the official language in 1940. Related to other Germanic languages west of Pretany.
Flsg.jpg Pretany Latin/French Romance Languages 1.2% exclusively Maybe Ancient language of the catholic church. If spoken anywhere else in the globe was due to spread of the church. All is known was that the Inaran Emperor converted to Catholicism and adopted the language for his 60 large temples he built in 1200 AD. It was then introduced to St. Richards in 1373 when it became the papacy and subsequently spread globally. Related to other Romance languages such as French, another language spoken in minority in St. Genvieve and Prairie Du Rocher. French is the evolved version of the local proto-tribal language that the Nortian Tribe spoke in 300AD. (the Nortian Language). The Nortian fishing city of Port Emporia founded in ancient pre-history was called "Port Emporia" by the locals even then. A Latin term. Latin and French seem to have arose from the Nortian Tribe. Port Emporia was the center of massive Inaran Empire in 1000AD, so it is to be assumed that any global spread of the romance languages spread during that time from the Nortian Tribe.
Latflag.png Latina Latinian most spain, but with french and italian elements Official language. Understood/spoken by ~99% of the population No Colonist (where?) 1500 Related to other "European" languages, who could have all originated in northwestern Uletha
Latflag.png Latina Dutch second language in the eastern states. Understood/spoken by ~55% of the population No Brought by colonists. 1500's from Dagelanden --Histor (talk) 22:01, 20 August 2014 (CEST).
Latflag.png Latina Indigen Latina see the link spoken by the indigen poeple til today Yes Greater group of languages in SE of Tarephia indigen
Lost country.png Bayland Bayese Descendant of a hypothetical sub-family of the Germanic language family 60% of the population use it as their first language, usually more towards the north of the country. Around 90% of the entire population has some working knowledge of the language. Partly The proto-language was brought into Bayland in around the 9th century and then the modern descendant languages evolved within Bayland from then onwards Related to other "Germanic" languages nearby (NW Uletha)
Lost country.png Bayland Framthish Descendant of a hypothetical sub-family of Indo-European 35% of the population use it as their first language, usually more towards the south of the country. Around 20% of the Bayese-speaking population claim to have at least some working knowledge of basic Framthish. Yes When the proto-language ("Proto-Ulethan"/Proto-Indo-European) came over to Bayland, this family developed in Bayland and covered most of Bayland until a while later when the Germanic language Bayese became the most common tongue over most of Northern Bayland Related to all "Ulethan" (Indo-European/European) languages in the world
FLAGZYL.png Zylanda Zylandian lower german Main official and national language No brought by colonists from NW Uletha. 1500's Related to other "European" languages
Akinyaka English/Inglish/Ingerish/? Identical to English Official language. Understood/spoken by ~90% of the population No Possibly brought from colonists from Ingerland/NW Uletha. 1700's Related to other "European" languages, who could have all originated in northwestern Uletha
Akinyaka French/Guyennish/? Identical to French Official language in some states. Understood/spoken by ~55% of the population No Brought by colonists. 1700's Related to other "European" languages, but all the others seem to have originated from NW Uletha. Principaute de Guyenne sounds very French. Maybe the language could have been originated from there? OR it could have originated from the Nortian Tribe, as mentioned above by Bhj867.
Luciano Flag FA.png Ardisphere Spanish/Spanesh/Casteñol/Castellanés/¿? Identical to Spanish Main official and national language No Possibly brought by colonists from NW Uletha. 1500's Related to other "European" languages, who could have all originated in northwestern Uletha
Luciano Flag FA.png Ardisphere English/Inglish/Ingerish/? Identical to English Minor language official only in Comuna de las Islas in the far south (Cabo Inglés) No Possibly brought by colonists from Ingerland/NW Uletha. 1700's Related to other "European" languages, who could have all originated in northwestern Uletha
Luciano Flag FA.png Ardisphere French/Frankish/Gaulaise/? Identical to French Minor language official only in Comuna Moyica in the far north (Mojique) No Possibly brought by colonists from NW Uletha. 1700's Related to other "European" languages, who could have all originated in northwestern Uletha
Luciano Flag FA.png Ardisphere Welsh/Camberic/Cymry/? Identical to Welsh Minor language official only in Colonia Galés, in use nationally by about 4% of the population No Possibly brought by colonists from NW Uletha. 1700's Related to other "European" languages, who could have all originated in northwestern Uletha
Luciano Flag FA.png Ardisphere Korean/Gohangukian/고한국어/go-han-guk-eo Identical to Korean Minor language official in the Colonia Coreana, nationally spoken by at least 10% of the population No Brought by colonists from Gohanguk An OGF Korean-analogue, I guess...? - I'm happy to work on this but I need to know where to put it?
Luciano Flag FA.png Ardisphere Altazorian Language Unique to Gwynian Minor official language in Departamento Libertad, spoken by the pre-colonial peoples of Ardisphere and in use by about 2% of the national population Yes This language is my own creation and a work-in-progress.
Luciano Flag MH.png Mahhal Mahhalian Language Unique to Mahhal Official language and in use by 99% of the population of Mahhal Yes This language is my own creation and a work-in-progress
Lost country.png Picard Aquérrese French-Latin Official in Aquerrais No Originally French but evolve overtime, losing many French characteristics. My creation
Lost country.png Picard Brunich Germanic Official in Brunden No
Wiwaxia Flag.jpg Wiwaxia Wiwaxish - a dialect of English/Inglish/Ingerish with some bits from the indigenous Edicarian thrown in
(should we decide on a single name?)
English with some Latinesque names for natural features such as rivers and lakes (Edicarian, the indigenous language is stolen from the Latin names for a lot of pre-Cambrian fossils) Widely used and understood by 100% of Wiwaxia's population No Brought by colonists from Ingerland(?) in 1600s Obviously related to other in-world European languages, presumably originating in NW Uletha.
Karolia flag.png Karolia Karolian Estonian with some Finnish and Hungarian but many spellings altered Usage: Official in Karolia (with Románš) and first language of 75%, recognized regional in Meridonia Yes Hungarian spoken in Istanoszag, but Estonian/Finnish not used elsewhere. Fits a unique language not brought by settlers.
Karolia flag.png Karolia Románš Based on Romanian and other minority Romance languages in Eastern Europe such as Friulan Usage: Official in Karolia (with Karolian) and first language of 15%, recognized regional in Meridonia Yes Evolved from ancient Romance language brought my migrants from neighbouring countries Only distantly related to Spanish and Italian spoken in neighbouring countries
Mazan Flag.png Mazan Mazanic Based on Semetic languages (Arabic, Hebrew, Maltese, etc.) Official language of Mazan Yes Origins stem from 11 B.C.
Wapashian Flag.png Wapashia Inretski Based on English, Russian, French, Japanese and Inuktitut words combined with a fictional indigenous grammar system Official language of Inretsk; spoken primarily by 75% of the population Yes Hybrid language synthesized between a local indigenous language and some Ingerish, Franquese and Slavonish words brought about by settlers Distantly related to other in-world European languages, but is nonetheless unique
NationalFlagRGNK.png Rogolnika Ingerish Based on real-world "English language" Official language of Rogolnika; used throughout the country No Brought by Ingerish colonists from Ingerland and Wiwaxia in the 16th century Related to the "Ulethan"(real-world European) languages
NationalFlagRGNK.png Rogolnika Kiolari Unique to Rogolnika Co-official with Ingerish language; used by about 77% (including the Kiolari people) of the total population Yes This language is my own creation and a work-in-progress
Maalfland Flag.png Maalfland Gaerman Almost identical to German nearly 100% / official language  ?
Ingerland-flag.png Ingerland Ingerish
Based on real-world English language nearly 100% / official language Yes
(because many of us consider that)
Schwaldia-flag.png Schwaldia German
(or its OGF equivalent)
Based on real-world German language nearly 100% / official language No
Maybe from southern neighbour - Kalm
Florescenta-flag.png Florescenta Português
(Or its OGF equivalent)
Based on real-world Portuguese language nearly 100% / official language Hope - No
(because this language is terra incognita for me)
Slavonia-flag.png Slavonia Salvonish
Based on mix of real-world Russian, Czech, Polish languages nearly 100% / official language Maybe
Scandmark-flag.png Scandmark Scandian
Based on fiction-world Norscand language nearly 100% / official language Yes
Tircambry-national-flag.png Tircambry Cambric (Cambraeg)
Identical to real-world Welsh nearly 100% / official language Yes