Forum:Ingrea/Capital city

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The capital city of Ingerland is located in the eastern part of the country, in the region #14^∈⊾, being the administrative, cultural and economic center of the nation. It's designated as a collaborative territory meaning everyone interested is welcome to contribute. However, to prevent the city from being mapped chaotically and to allow it to grow naturally, the city should be planned thoroughly in this section before anything is mapped.

NOTE: The capital should not be based directly off London. The city should have some distinct and unique characteristics. Nevertheless, London is welcome as an inspiration.

What to discuss: The exact location of the capital city within its own region. The geography of the region - (inherited from the national geographic plan) Historical growth of the city Population/size Infrastructure And various other aspects, bits and pieces...

User proposals

Sudo91's proposal:

At first, I would like to point out the suggested size for the capital. It will, of course, depend on how many people will live in Ingerland proper. If we take the population density of IRL UK (270/sq.km), Ingerland would have 139 mln. people. Although, I doubt that such population density is possible at such high latitudes, nor it can be as low as Scottish (67/sq.km). For my calculations down below, I took the population density of 150/sq.km. and got the supposed population of Ingerland at 77 310 000. (UK has 67 mln) Whatever the case, we probably should keep the population density of Winburgh (I would also like to keep the same name; there are myriads of objects all around OGF named after Winburgh) around the same as London (5500-6000 per sq.km.) and the city area may accomodate 1500-2000 sq.km in total. The agglomeration Location within capital region The capital should, of course, be placed along the river. I shifted the "centre" location to the position on the left because I believe it looks more defendable: rivers cut the access to the fort at three sides, and on the fourth side there are hills. Later on, the development of industry may lead to mass building at more flat areas, such as where "capital" marker is located on OGF at the moment. Geography of the region Here is an another map featuring main obstacles that would play key role in city's strategic position -- hills and marshes. Most of the marshes would be gone by the present day, and hills were turned into national parks or natural reserves. Geography of the region Historical growth Here's the sketch map on how the growth will go. The city's size before 1700 was quite negligible. Population/size I would estimate the capital agglomeration's population at 8 mln - 11 mln. The capital region area's population should not exceed 15 mln people. I also have this very crude map of main railways (excluding local ones) and main motorways in agglomeration. My proposal is probably too early since we don't have main transport corridors planned. Sudo91 (talk) 19:00, 3 May 2023 (UTC)

Discussion

The northeastern and the southern part of the capital region could be hilly as there are rivers from adjacent regions kinda originating in those locations. As a center of culture, economy, and administration, population could be at least 10% of the total population of Ingerland. In infrastructure, there could be a symmetrical layout of a palace surrounded by gardens as the seat of government, or castles that are now museums. Senju (talk) 02:11, 1 May 2023 (UTC)

I really don't want the capital to be called Winburgh - it is such an ugly name that's also not very typical of English naming conventions (it's much more like Edinburgh which is Scottish). Winburgh can stay as a decent sized city in the north. Gubble (talk) 16:39, 5 May 2023 (UTC)

There's absolutely nothing wrong with "burgh" from an etymology perspective: "Burh and burg were Old English developments of the Proto-Germanic word reconstructed as *burg-s, cognate with the verb *berg-an[1] ("to shut in for protection").[2] They are cognate with German Burg, Dutch burcht and Scandinavian borg and, in English, developed variously as "borough",[1] "burg",[3] and (particularly in the East Anglian region of England and Scotland) "burgh".[4]" (from wikipedia:Burh#Name) /wangi (talk) 10:15, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Name

Shall we try and get a name assigned to the capital city by the end of this year? I would suggest that we invite suggestions over a three-week period and then vote over the following couple of weeks so that we have a decision by the end of the year. Anyone should be welcome to submit ideas but the decision will be made by Ingerland mappers.

If there are no objections, I'll start a proposals list in a couple of days with a submission deadline of 14th December. Pawl (talk) 11:56, 21 November 2023 (UTC)

Proposals

If you have any proposals for a name for the capital of Ingerland, please add them below by 14th December.

Num	Name	Comments
0	Winburgh	Transfer the name from the previous capital. Etymology: wentā (from a common Celtic word meaning "tribal town" or "meeting place") + burgh (Old English, fortified settlement)
1	Andon	A nod to Andy, the creator of the original Ingerland. In-world, it could be named after the city's founder, e.g. Andreus
2	Anditon
3	Reydon	Already the name of a city outside of Winburgh, which was utilised by me as the etymology of the provincial capital for Ingerish Asperia. However, I think it would work well as the name for the capital. Obvious disadvantage is the similarity to “London” - but people can decide on that. Etymologically, I also think it would work as it could be derived from the Latin “regium oppidum” which translates to “royal town”. Arlo (talk) 23:33, 1 December 2023 (UTC)Arlo
4	Boldon	From the name of the local Celtic tribe - something like Bolcanae? Pawl (talk) 11:11, 8 December 2023 (UTC)
5	Eastminster	Minster in the east :-) Pawl (talk) 11:11, 8 December 2023 (UTC)
6	Dominster	Contraction of "lord's castle/fort" Domini castrum, castrum > caester (OE) > chester. Pawl (talk) 11:11, 8 December 2023 (UTC)
7	Rexton	Town of the King. An alternative to number 3, which I think sounds too much like the radioactive gas Radon! Pawl (talk) 11:11, 8 December 2023 (UTC)
8	Drenham	Perhaps the river can be the River Drenn so this could mean something like village on the Drenn or land in the riverbend of the Drenn Ruadh (talk) 08:56, 23 December 2023 (UTC)
9	Dinester	Perhaps related to Celtic dunon hill/fort and Old English ceaster town Ruadh (talk) 08:56, 23 December 2023 (UTC)
10	Keliston	Kell's town/stone Ruadh (talk) 08:56, 23 December 2023 (UTC)
11	Rother/Rothe	Landing place Ruadh (talk) 08:56, 23 December 2023 (UTC)
12	Wendon	https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Wen Ruadh (talk) 23:37, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

There's quite a list of names there! Could we narrow it down by choosing our favourites, or our top two or three? I think my top two are Dominster or Wendon. But there are only about three I definitely don't like. Pawl (talk) 08:26, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

My personal preferences would go to keeping Winburgh, or using Dominster, Rexton, or Rother/Rothe with the stipulation there that using Rother/Rothe would require a suffix like -ster, -ton, -don, etc. For me, that would be Rothedon. -- Aces California (talk) 17:12, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

Okay if I'm going to nominate a few for a vote, in no particular order, Wendon, Dominster and Rexton. Ruadh (talk) 13:11, 21 January 2024 (UTC)

My votes are for Dinester (or something like Dinecester if you want to confuse people with pronounciation), Rothe, and Wendon. In general I'd prefer something somewhat unique-sounding and not too reminiscent of London. Yuanls (talk) 12:33, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Name selection

Ingerland mappers: Please choose your preferred and an alternate option for the capital city's name. Please note that names not chosen for the capital proper can be reused for other various prominent localities in the country, whether it be for other major cities, royal residencies, seats of government, etc. Additionally, the name "Winburgh" is going to be preserved for the existing city. This choice is for the new capital and will not effect the original city. — Alessa (talk) 21:09, 10 February 2024 (UTC)

It would be good to get this settled ...

Can I propose that we take the four names which were chosen more than once and each list our first and second choices? If nothing gets a majority of first choices we can add second choices to the totals, and if there's a tie, we can have a runoff vote with only the top two.

The four with multiple selections were:

• Dominster
• Rexton
• Rothe
• Wendon

We could still utilize losing names for things like the main government borough within the capital (like Westminster) or the location of a major royal castle or palace outside the capital (like Windsor).

If people are agreeable to going ahead this way, my choices are 1) Wendon, 2) Dominster. - Pawl (talk) 09:15, 10 February 2024 (UTC)

Wendon would be my preference. Rexton probably second preference. Myrcia (talk) 18:41, 26 March 2024 (UTC)

My preferences would be Rexton first, then Dominster second. Relegate Rothe to a local area, or name of a river, until it's decided if/and what suffix can be added to it. I still believe Rothe+suffix would make for a good place name non-the-less. --Aces California (talk) 08:36, 29 March 2024 (UTC)

Wendon first, then Dominster, would be my preference. Ruadh (talk) 19:45, 5 April 2024 (UTC)

There's still one person to vote, but with three first-preference votes out of a possible five I guess Wendon is the winner. We can still use all the other three in some capacity. - Pawl (talk) 09:54, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

Planning the capital city. Initial sketches and suggestions

Here's my sketch for the old town. It's far from finished, but can be used as a basis for the further mapping.

Sudo91 (talk) 09:52, 17 May 2024 (UTC)